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Thread: Support Barack Obama

  1. #11
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
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    387

    Default

    Truth be told:

    1. Obama favors a middle class tax cut.
    2. He promises universal health insurance, not government health care. Unlike other Democrats he plans to do this through a package of incentives rather than forced mandates. In fact, he is criticized by Clinton for not using a mandate to require coverage of every American.
    3. He promised to shift troops from Iraq to Afghanistan, and to responsibly pull troops out of Iraq, and to not do so precipitously.


    The test of some one's moral character are their actions, not their scripture. I think it is wrong for people to denigrate Romney's or Huckabee's religious beliefs, although there is plenty of ammunition to do so. In the same way, I think it is wrong for Chasboots to slyly put down Obama's religion. Although, I'm not familiar with his church's specific tenets, I've seen a number of false articles regarding Obama, aimed at assassinating his character. More importantly, every religion, even mainstream religions like Catholicism, ask their followers to make rather unnerving oaths that we all do as a matter of routine, but most people don't really mean. How many Catholics do you think really believe in transubstantiation (the belief that the wine we take during communion really, physically, becomes the blood of Christ which is to be ingested)? How many Christians, which Obama is, really believe, literally, that Christ will come down with a sword in mouth and smite all the unbelievers as stated in the Book of Revelations? So please, Chasboots, don't insinuate there is something wrong with Obama's character by criticizing the church he belongs to. In my mind, that is simply un-American.

    As for experience, as much as the pundits want you to believe, being a Governor doesn't necessarily prepare you to be an effective President (just look at Bush or Carter). Being a CEO also doesn't necessarily prepare you for being President, neither does being in the military. All of these may help, but what matters is the type of experience you have gained in your life. If as a governor, CEO, senator, or general you learned the wrong lessons, then your experience counts for very little. Just look at Rumsfield, Bush, and Cheney, for all their experience they still used very poor judgment with regards to respecting the constitution, expanding executive power, managing Katrina, and executing a sound foreign policy. With experience like that, I'll take Obama's experience and judgment any day.

    Obama's experience is rooted in people's real lives, not the bubble of power most politicians become entrapped in. I like the fact that much of Obama's experience comes from outside the halls of power. Shoot..., do you really think Bush would have been elected without his daddy's last name, his daddy's money, or his daddy's connections? Without those, Bush probably would have rose to the level of a very good manager at Dairy Queen, that's it. Obviously, Obama is a heck of a lot better than that.

    When I look at the field of Presidential candidates, I see serious risks in all of them. With Obama though, I believe he is more than a risk we should take, he is a risk we need to take. With all the other candidates, we don't need them as a country.

    By the way, being smart and an effective communicator are necessary traits all quality Presidents have.
    Liberty without learning is always in peril; learning without liberty is always in vain. - JFK

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    1,106

    Default NJ

    Copperlad,

    Yes, it's embarrasing to live here in one of the few sections of NJ that isn't "Blue." Given how amazingly well the democrats have done in leading this state to where it is today, why would anyone want anything but a (D) next to a candidate's name?

    I'm not going to discuss who I'm going to vote for here, but I will start another thread addressing just how great The Big Blue Machine is running...

  3. #13

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Demarn
    ...Just look at Rumsfield, Bush, and Cheney, for all their experience they still used very poor judgment with regards to respecting the constitution, expanding executive power, managing Katrina, and executing a sound foreign policy. ...
    In making this statement you are making an assumption about their goals and motivations. It is clear that both Bush and Cheney wanted to greatly expand the powers of their offices, the Constitution be damned. As for foreign policy, if your goal was to kill the person who tried to kill your father, then you accomplished it. Or, if your goal was to create obscene profits for the company where you were the CEO or your oil company buddies, then you accomplished it. And, if you don't give a damn about the people, well...

  4. #14

    Default

    It never ceases to amaze, you should never talk about politics or religion because it's always a lose/lose situation.

  5. #15

    Default Not a (D)

    Steve-
    I'm not a (D)*, but have voted for both (D)'s and (R)'s all my life. I tend to judge people by what they say, not party affiliation. I have just as much trouble with the blue area I used to live in, as the (R) area I'm in now.

    My problem is more with those who don't believe in the two party system, because they rule one out automatically or actually believe the propaganda that comes out of the radio.

    * this despite my being an unaware Kusinich supporter.

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    1,043

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Demarn
    Truth be told:

    1. Obama favors a middle class tax cut.
    2. He promises universal health insurance, not government health care. Unlike other Democrats he plans to do this through a package of incentives rather than forced mandates. In fact, he is criticized by Clinton for not using a mandate to require coverage of every American.
    3. He promised to shift troops from Iraq to Afghanistan, and to responsibly pull troops out of Iraq, and to not do so precipitously.
    Ok, let's be clear on something...

    1. Any "middle class tax cut" is a euphemism for a tax increase on the "rich", a term which has had an arbitrary line of demarcation depending on who is using it. This is no different than re-distribution of wealth, a.k.a. socialism (a form of government the far-left liberals would love for us to have). Ronald Reagan had it right with "trickle-down economics". If you hamstring the top 10% of wage earners and corporations the added costs will filter (or trickle) down to the middle and lower classes who have to buy the goods and services these people make available. Furthermore, the increased revenue to the government will be used to fund ridiculous pet projects and entitlement programs, the latter of which they have a project track record for mismanaging.

    2. Whether it is universal health care of insurance coverage, the fact remains that Obama and the Democrats want the federal government involved. That's a big mistake. Just ask a Canadian or a Brit how far in advance they have to make a doctor's appointment or how much they want to come to the US for treatment. The problem with our healthcare system, which ALL of the candidates deftly avoid, is that the legal profession has done the most damage with frivolous law suits and subsequent awards. As a result, doctors, hospitals and pharceutical companies have had to increase their rates and fees to cover malpractice insurance.

    3.I have not heard Obama say that he would favor a phased pull out of troops from Iraq so I'll give you (and him) the benefit of the doubt on that claim. The problem remains that it should be done when the time is right. Not when it is politically expedient or because we've become wishy-washy over the war. The decision on troop reduction should only be made or recommended by the commanders in the field, not by ambitious politicians living half a world away. Some of the most ardent anti-war members of Congress (hello, Jack Murtha) have tempered or reversed their positions since the troop surge began to work. Progress is being made. Let the troops do their job and finish it.



    Quote Originally Posted by Demarn
    In the same way, I think it is wrong for Chasboots to slyly put down Obama's religion. Although, I'm not familiar with his church's specific tenets, I've seen a number of false articles regarding Obama, aimed at assassinating his character.
    And for the record, I was not trying to (slyly or otherwise) put down Obama's religion. What I was referring to is how the media elite seem to be obsessed with the fact that Romney is a Mormon and Huckabee is a Baptist minister, suggesting that their respective religious beliefs makes them incapable of being president. Yet, by contrast, the church that Obama attends (http://www.tucc.org) includes amongst its pages "The Black Value System". Let me pose THIS question: Suppose a Republican candidate attended a church with "The White Value System" on its web site. Wouldn't that engender cries of racism and segregation? I don't have a problem with Obama being Christian or any other religion. I DO have a problem with his church advocating such separatist and racist positions without being challenged by the same people who would challenge the Mormon and Baptist candidates.

  7. #17

    Default Greenwich Township shared services

    While we are busy discussing who we would like to vote for we need to look in our own backyards.

    Are you aware that there are 3 houses on the auction block in Greenwich Chase on 1/28/08

    Do you care or wonder why ; if we do not do something at the grass roots all our homes will be on the auction block.
    We can do something about it ;Shared services is a start
    Why do we need 5 Mayors in this small geographical area?
    Why do we need 5 School Superintedents?
    Why not 1 Police force with auxilaries in each area.I can go on ...........
    I note that the beneficiaries ie ( POLITICIANS) mayor etc are in favor of the continuation of this corrupt Napolean government for power and benefits but for who?

  8. #18

    Default Support Barack Obama

    Biggest problem with him is he is too young and has very little experience. I have no comfort level with somebody "learning as he goes" in the most powerful office in the world. He talks a good game but he simply doesn't have the miles under his belt... and for that there is no way i'll ever vote for him.

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    1,106

    Default Who next? Sharpton? Garofalo? Rove?

    Do you remember 1999 and 2003, when you really believed "it can't get any worse than this..."??

    In 1999, yes, we had John McCain - as misguided then as he is now - but we also had Elizabeth Dole.

    In 1999 we had Al Gore, an opportunist of the worst kind until you met John Kerry - an even worse opportunits (nice how he slammed John Edwards today, eh? That's called "loyalty" to John "can I marry someone richer than a Heinz?" Kerry). But we also had... well, nobody really. The Dems have been showing loons for years now. Obama really is the sanest person they have run in a long, long time.

    But he really is too young and inexperienced.

    It was bad enough having to choose between two losers 4 years ago, but this year it's looking pretty much doomed.

    Mike Huckabee? Are you kidding me?
    Hillary Clinton? If she's not the poster child for "count the silverware after she leaves," I don't know who is. Snoop Dogg is more honest. At least with him, WYSIWYG.
    John McCain again? How many times do we have to tell him no?
    John Edwards? If he told me he was on fire and I could see the flames, feel the heat, and smell the smoke, I'd still know that he was lying.

    There have to be at least 50 million Americans old enough to run for this office. Probably more like 100 million, but even if it's only 50... is this really the best we can do?

  10. #20

    Default Re: Who next? Sharpton? Garofalo? Rove?

    Quote Originally Posted by steve447
    ... There have to be at least 50 million Americans old enough to run for this office. Probably more like 100 million, but even if it's only 50... is this really the best we can do?
    Why would any sane person voluntarily spend 18 months, 7 days a week, 16 plus hours a day getting beaten up by their rivals, the press, the bloggers, and the pundits?

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